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People need a reality check here. Check the fixtures there are 18 league matches on average per week. If umpires get fifty quid a match as wanted, now times that by two as there are two at each match. that is an outlay of eighteen hundred quid a week in umpires fees!!!!

Reference comments from Chris Busby about umpires fees etc.
As others have mentioned we are certainly not comparing like for like. A bit of a difference for 80 minutes playing time compared to a 50 overs per side cricket match lasting 6/7 hours. Don't forget umpires also have travelling time to/from games plus they too have to be there an hour before play begins and after the game they could also have to remain behind to deal with various matters pertaining to the game. Rarely I guess less than a 10 hour day.
Chris talks about the distance rugby referees have to travel - umpires are the same as these days games are played all over the north and also I understand umpires sometimes travel all over Ireland - North & South on umpire exchanges etc.
Chris says he gets no match fee - well 32 pounds to travel is pretty good for say a 100 mile round trip plus the perk of probably getting rugby international tickets which I guess if he wished he could sell at inflated prices !! He says he has to pay a referees membership fee - so do the umpires and they also pay for their courses,exams etc. plus all their gear.
Nobody is suggesting hugh fees for umpires - certainly not 150 pounds per game although I guess the umpires would like this !! It has been suggested 50 pounds per game this season would be a fair starting point with annual reviews - I really don't think this would break the bank for most if not all the clubs who currently are supplied with umpires week after week.

JW "Ernie" McCleary
Ulster sport has lost a genuine all-rounder with the sad passing of 88 year-old Ernie McCleary. School teacher Ernie was a fine right-handed batsman who excelled at Cliftonville after moving from Lurgan in the 1950s. He was also an outstanding centre-half for Cliftonville Football Club and won many honours including an international cap against Wales. He was passionate about sport and the spirit of the game. Always an engaging conversationalist he was a great ambassador of both codes. Unfortunately his last few years were not so good after he was diagnosed with Alzheimer's Disease.
Sincere condolences to his family and many friends at both Cliftonville Cricket and Football Clubs.
Clarence Hiles
Editor

I'm afraid I can't make out what $^x8*@80 or *%:$150/8 is ? Or maybe my screens faulty ?

How an ever, all I was trying to say is that it can be a long day out in the middle but no less enjoyable for that !

As someone who was involved as an "active" rugby referee from the 70s to the mid noughties I note from Chris's posting that little has changed in the USRFR. I note the "massive" rise in the mileage rate, which was around 25p in my day. I did the trips to Strabane and City of Derry but then this was off set by the likes of the Ballymoney & Antrim games. I'm not sure that AIL referees get the same level of payment but I would suggest that their rate may be higher. The situation has changed from those early days in that there were more games than referees available. That is no longer the case. I can recall that senior sides like Malone ran at least 12 teams, Ballymena 6 and Bangor 6 to name a few. There was a marked increase in recent years of young guys who saw the opportunities afforded to progress "up the levels" coing into the Society. Cricket on the other hand has too many games with too few umpires and the age profile is indicative of the problems that lie ahead. I would iterate my earlier posting that the numbers attending this year's course will go no way to cover the shortfall and indicate that yet again clubs are not facing up to their responsibility for another season. Clearly another long summer for Ian Houston who carries out his almost impossible task - I can't think of anyone who would be as phlegmatic and good humoured to do the job of Appointments Secretary.

Ref: C Boomer

No doubt that time is a factor, although in fairness rugby reffing generally takes at least 3.5/4 hours (we have to be there at least 60 mins beforehand) without travel time so your still talking about it taking up most of your Saturday afternoon. The odd trip to Cavan/ Monaghan/ Derry will easily take up as much time as a cricket match.

This doesnt change the fact that there are about 100 active refs every Saturday from whom money is no factor (indeed I've just got an email this afternoon to pay subs this year so I'm paying for the privilege).

The point I was making about pay is that to pay a decent wage (I used �8/ hour as a base level) that it would cost at least �150 per match which just wont be sustainable. I dont ever think the union will be in a position to persuade people to get involved in Umpiring for financial reasons and so it may be better to focus on other motives- fitness, staying involved in the game, avoiding shopping on a Saturday afternoon???

re C Boomer

Far from the umpires fees being exaggerated they could even be cut price if I'm using your figures.

8 hours x 8 = 64

50 mile round trip = 16

Total �80..... but that's only for one umpire. If travel time is paid then that can only get greater.

Chris Busby

With respect Chris, Maximum permitted time for a rugby match 80 mins + injury time and off home for the rest of the day !

Minimum time for a cricket match 4 hours, but usually anywhere between 6 to 10 hours and the possibility if rain intervenes, start again Monday evening or a replay !

And by the time you get home of an evening, reheat your tea in the oven if the dog hasn't already got it and then it's bedtime !

And the figures you're quoting for umpire fees if I'm reading them correctly are grossly exaggerated even if that includes a well deserved increased payment for same !

Sad to learn of the passing away of Ernie McCleary. A true gentleman who had amazing talents.

'RE: Umpires

The recent conversations regarding Umpires makes interesting reading. Just to throw something into the mix: I referee rugby during the winter,expected to travel to Derry and Monaghan etc on a fairly regular basis for the princely match fee of absolutely nothing. We are paid 32p per mile and that's it (aside from some fringe benefits such as priority booking for internationals etc). What's even more astounding is that there are more rugby refs who want to do this on a Saturday afternoon than there are games, on a weekly basis I'll hear other refs complain that they haven't been given a game for the past few weeks.

I suppose the point I'm trying to make is that money is surely only part of the issue, realistically I can't see it being sustainable for Umpires to be paid a reasonable wage by most people's standards (say we paid �8 per hour that would mean paying put around �150 per game for Umpires when travel expenses are taken into account).

I am delighted to see the comments of Mr. Burton. He certainly makes many cogent points. On a personal basis I wonder if some of those high spending clubs would consider financing improvements in accomodation for umpires & scorers - as well as buying better sightscreens? Or perhaps money is a bit tight for such nonsense!

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Sorry Wylie but anyone who wishes to wear white coat can continue to do so on a Saturday or any other day. NIACUS has never made new clothing mandatory for umpires.

Reference my earlier posts with some suggestions to possibly encourage more people to take up umpiring and especially to improve considerably the fees paid to those who do it.
So far there seems to be a deathly silence from most clubs - especially those clubs who splash their money around paying lots of players - and also from senior clubs who week by week get the benefit from having official umpires.
Have they nothing to contribute on the subject ? Do they support a change in the current structure and do they agree the current match fee paid is far too low and unrealistic. Would clubs support/accept an immediate increase? Let them be open and honest. I don't believe the majority of umpires do it for the love of the game - those days have long since gone if they ever existed in the first place. Those who stand for 50 or more games in a season certainly don't do it just for fun !!
What do the NCU think needs to be done - they too have been silent - let them come out in the open and tell us all what fees are currently paid and what they propose for the 2013 season. Too many are sticking their heads in the sand in the hope things will keep limping along when we all know there are serious problems which need addressed without further delay.
It will be interesting to see how many more paid players will be signed by NCU clubs (and others) from Limavady following their recent decision to drop out of the NWCU top flight. As Andy Kennedy commented so much for loyalty as several players are already looking at where they will go next - I guess it will be to clubs who pay the most and certainly not for the love of the game. Why don't they stay at Limavady and help the club survive.
Now over to forum members for their constructive views/comments.

That is actually astounding about Limavady...

It should serve as an archetypal example to the money men who are 'hell bent, on destroying the local game...

The game may well becomming more professional on the Irelands international stage - but when oh when will these 'moneydriving egotists' realise the the irreperable damage they're doing locally...

Believe me, if the North West is 'Sneezing' - the NCU will soon catch cold...

Someone said that 'Loyalty' dosen't retain players - what rubbish, that's exactlly what it does - it's the money that drives a sword through the 'heart and soul' of our 100 year old plus clubs...!

I've played for over 35 years - and to be honest, it's the obligation to my club and good friends, that keeps me going...

All be warned - and as I look to the 'East' I see the 'Vultures' beginning to circle...

Watch this space...