Forum

i definately think a restructuring needs to take place, not just in NCU but all the unions. i would like to see CI have an input into local cricket and standardise all the unions.

the top flights of NCU, NWCU and LCU should be 8 team leagues. get rid of ulster cup and also reformat the ISC with 24 teams of the 3 unions split into 4 leagues of 6 teams, with 2 from each union in each league. you will be guarenteed at least 4 games against teams from other unions but only 2 away days. the top 4 teams play semis and then the new ISC final.

the first round of local league matches are played, then the new irish league/cup format can be played in june, then the second round of league matches, 19 games for ALL teams (excluding semis and final) with still enough time left in the season for each unions own cup and 20/20 comp to be slotted in somewhere.

amount of scheduled games would be

league - 14
ISC - 5 (+ 1)
local cup - 1 (+ 2)

min 20 max 23

at the minute we play min 21 and max 30

same rules should be used in all comps with 8 day rescheduling rule

sorry this is a bit long winded but what do u think???

Ivan
I think the main problem with play offs is exactly when do you complete the league programme? At this point nobody is sure.

However if you introduce an 8 day rearrangement rule similar to North West then the fixtures shouldn't spill over too far.

What you could do is even one down/one up and have 2nd last join 2nd, 3rd, and 4th in the lower league for play offs. Everyone would have something to play right to the very end of the season.

The player draft would actually be very exciting but one step at a time, we don't want anyone choking on their G&T!

Paul
Interesting idea the "drafting ". I heard them discuss this on radio the other day re Premiership Football and like you thought we could maybe introduce it here. It would allow Cricket Ireland to offer an elite squad of contracted players and then "loan" them out to say the teams in UPL 1 and the Lienster League One. If clubs have the money to pay local players they certainly could contribute towards the centrally contracted players.
Can't really understand what is wrong with the play off system. It would still give teams something to play for right to the end of the season but might just eliminate the yo yoing that I think will go on with straight 2 up 2 down. Do we know for sure that the Leinster clubs are totally happy with the current regulations.

Ivan
Despite all that is said and done I know you would support it (an UPL). I have asked a number of teams about in the North West and the players I talked to are keen on it and are up for the challenge.

If an Inter-Pro is re-introduced it would need to be radically different to the version that fell by a wayside a few years back. The fact is the North West players prefer to play for their club and are disinterested in Inter-Pros. I can guarantee you they will become disillusioned pretty quickly with playing against even more overseas players passed off as locals. With the exception of 'Ifty' and Eaglestone I don't know too many others that would qualify.
It doesn't matter to me where someone is born but the North West hasn't benefited with cricket playing immigrants to the extent of other regions.
Club cricket is where it is at right now. Players hearts (and wallets) lie there. Stopping player payments now is like pushing water uphill. Much better to start again and regulate it. Clubs will still be free to make their own decisions within a permissable framework. If you want original thought Ivan there is always the possibility of introducing a player draft not unlike the IPL or American Football. Cricket genuinely could be revolutionised here if we want to, but we are good at saying no in Ulster. For some it is never, never, never to an UPL.

They don't appear to have any problem with 2 up 2 down in the Leinster Cricket Union's Senior League set-up where they have two leagues of seven rather than eight teams each, so I don't see the need for end of season play-offs in the new NCU structures if they are passed.

Paul
The vision I had of the UL a while back is very much on the lines you now suggest.I don't for one second think you "scupprered " my thoughts because I have never for one second thought that anyone bothers or cares what I ( or you ) think could improve our game. The declining numbers are worrying and will continue until radical changes are made. I was told at the weekend by someone close to the powers that be that Cricket Ireland intend introducing an inter pro competition next season. Has anyone else heard about this? I would certainly give my support to your UPL idea.

Ivan,

The playoff would be a great idea in the eight-team league set-up, but there is still no guarantee of games being cleared up on time for the best sides to meet. More chance than with ten though, and on that basis it would be a good idea.

Better to avoid playing in it though, it'd be a real cup final type game!

Ivan (I've explained this before)
Late in 2006 when the Ulster League was first mooted it came from the Cricket Development committee from within the NCU. The competition proposed was a league/cup hybrid on a Champions league format and was a genuine attempt to recognise some fundamental problems in our game. Bearing in mind most clubs who would rightly target their own leagues as a priority I felt the competition was doomed from the start. I also favoured then a return to Inter-Provincials as the preferred gap filler between club and country.

What has changed? Well the Inter-Pros won't work not least because the Ireland players with so many other committments won't play. Many of the best club players aren't interested.

The cricket both in the NW and the NCU is stale and that is why so many clubs are struggling.

I revisited the UL idea because I felt if it was ever going to work it needed to be absolute. In other words not a cup but a league and the only league you enter. I feel that this new league has huge potential and would be easier to market on a Province wide basis. There is also room for the NCU and NW to continue to run their own leagues (and Senior Cup) so that players who are recreational players can still enjoy their cricket locally.
I'm sorry Ivan if you think I scupperred your UL 2 years ago but it wasn't the right competition and the timing was wrong. It is ironic that I am criticised by you for being unoriginal and by others for being far too radical.

Those who want no change to the status quo have yet to come up with any viable proposals to stop the decline in playing numbers. The NCU own official statistics confirm that decline and that hasn't taken into account 2007 and 2008 which most people believe has accelerated the process.

You can say what you like about me but all I have ever wanted was to make the game more enjoyable for players and better to watch for spectators.

Gareth
Sorry I was suggesting the play off in an eight team league. Unlike Nile Smith I would rather see quality than quantity. By my reckoning in an eight team league would be finished by end of August with the play off first week of September.

I don't think this is a good idea. Fourteen games is not enough league cricket really. This is an over-reaction by knee-jerking band-wagonners simply because of a few wet saturdays coming late in the season.

Ivan,

I can see where you and the others are coming from with a playoff as it would potentially be a thrilling game and would allow a bit of leeway between two-up two-down in an eight team league. Unfortunately though I am not sure if it is an idea that would work in local cricket.

Imagine if there was a promotion/relegation playoff this year for example in the NCU between Sections One and Two, where would it be pencilled in with so many fixtures outstanding? Also, as seen with September cricket, it might not be a case of best teams being fielded but rather a case of who teams can gather up outside of their other rugby/football and goodness knows what other commitments. I don't know if an entire season can come down to what is destined to be a late September Saturday every year, especially when so much potentially rides on the fixture.

Very much not criticising an idea for the sake of it, because it is something I have thought about. Guess it is going to be really difficult for the NCU Directorates to get everything right for everyone.

Ivan
The game is already administered nationally for the betterment of the national team, and they don’t ‘give a toss’ about local provincial cricket, which is why it is dying on its feet, with the exception at senior level of half a dozen clubs.
Clubs will have to learn to help themselves or they are going to go by the wayside.

Michael / John
Agree that the play off idea might be beeter than automatic two up two down.

Staffy
Is it always a case with you of no original thought just the opposite view to someone else. A year or so ago when a few of us on here were proposing an Ulster League you were shooting it down on the grounds of too much travelling. Now that you have rediscovered the Glenshane Pass you think travelling isn't an issue even allowing for a massive hike in fuel prices. However I agree that your proposed UPL 1 and 2 would bring for better more competitive games. This season I haven't found myself tempted to travel to watch a game apart from the NW Cup Final , the ISC Final and a few internationals. There are too many meaningless, predictable games but I fear that this will never get off the ground as the "turkey's voting for Christmas " mindset will take over. I think we need a Howard Wells type character to railroad through a few changes and not give a toss who gets annoyed as long as it's for the best of the game locally, nationally and internationally.

Would 2 up 2 down be too much for an 8 team league? Granted it has created brilliant competition for 10 team leagues, but I'm not sure it would work for 8 team leagues. Interesting to see how the pro 40 has been set-up. Maybe we could adapt it to having a play off say between the team that finishes in 7th in section 1 against the team that finished in 2nd of section 2?