Forum

I'm surprised to read that posting from Bruce Topping. Someone who played sport at the highest level and who played cricket with some of the best competitors the NCU has seen.
Friendlies are a total waste of time apart from pre season when batsmen want to get their eye in and feet moving and bowlers want to get some overs in their legs.
If people want social cricket what about some Friday evening " tavenerers style " matches on a regional basis purely on a social , nothing at stake basis. Playing cricket but not wanting to win to me is a complete waste of 6 hours.
I think young players only develop as players when they realise winning is everything. If we want them to be technically good just get them more net time. I know players who are international class in the nets but just don't have that bit extra which makes them effective match players.
I think the main thing wrong with club cricket is that everyone has gone soft.
Let's look at way's to maximise not minimumize the amount of competitive cricket.
Why not have regional Twenty20 leagues played on say a Thursday evening. About 30 years ago years ago we had a great 20 over league in East Antrim with Carrick,Larne,Ballymena,Muckamore,Templepatrick and I think Cliftonville. Thst's 5 games plus say a cup game or two. The great thing about that league was it didn't restrict who you could play but by nature some regular 1sts players opted out giving opportunity for players to step up and play against better players in a competitive game. ( I don't think this league was affiliated to the NCU ).
Young people have more options now days but I really think we can attract them to cricket if we coach them that winning is everything. I think we should adjust start times, number of overs in 3rds and 4ths ( where most young players can get hooked on the game ), the rearrangement issues ( I personally think the NWCU model is better than anything else I have seen proposed ) and all that before we reduce our league cricket by 22% in one fell swoop.

I would also be very much in favour of 8 team leagues to increase quality in the leagues.
I have been very disappointed in the last two seasons that the some promotion and relegation issues have been settled by 20 over games and on rain affected pitches in September rather than as 50 over matches. It is a 50 over league after all.

To my mind it would be much better to schedule an 8 team league to finish in the first week in August by sheduling some double header weekends (Saturday & Sundays) when the weather is generally better from mid June to end of July.

I would treat the 50 over league as the premier competition and attempt to have all matches played as 50 over matches on decent dry batting tracks.

I also feel we have an unhealthy fixation with league cricket. Your club does not have to shut down just because the league season is finished.
If the league was to finish in the first week in August, clubs would be able to organise friendlies with clubs outside their own league.

Clubs could also play different forms of cricket such as time games (11am to 6pm , two day games, T20 cricket etc)

Playing only league cricket leads to presure to win all the time and can hinder the development of young players. By all means put your strongest team out on the pitch for league games but use friendlies to blood younger players in different types of game.

For me cricket is also a social event as well as a competitive one and while I enjoy the competitive nature of the league campaign I would also like the opportunity to play different forms of cricket (especially time cricket) and against teams I would not ordinarily play against.

Good man Stevie Max
At least you hav'ent lost your sense of humour anyway! See you guys next season,all being well.
Cheers Vic.

Vic - "As I say, its a bit of fun and banter or is that now a taboo in cricket as well.
And for the few that do know me from the lower leagues, I'm sure they'll agree; I take my cricket just as serious as any 'Pro', Premier league player or 'Sugar-daddy' in the country!" - Judging by the way you bat, I didn't think you took it that seriously!!! LOL. Enjoy your winter break, and tell Davy he can move up the order next season and you can open the bowling!

I have to admit that I was for 10 team leagues but as I listened to the debate I thought maybe 8 teams is a good idea but wasn't 100% convinced. I was edging towards the " let's try it " camp.
However after reading Peter, Nile and Wayne's posts if I was voting today it would be for 10 team leagues. I can't really see how less teams will improve the cricket that much. It will defenitly create a more them and us split and make the clubs with money stronger. It will also be a great boost to the many golf courses struggling for players.
As Peter and Wayne suggest why don't we leave the leagues alone and tinker about with the cup competitions and rearrangement issues. I am baffled at the pressure down the leagues highlighted by Stuart. They only have the league and one cup competition and 3rds and below its a fourteen game season anyway.
Maybe it's time the captains and leaders sat down with their players and asked " are you committing to the season or not, and if you're not then I'm going to get someone who will ".
I fear it'll go to 14 league games,then 14 with NO rearrangements , then 14 games of 40 overs, then I suppose the eventual step just before we bury cricket for ever is 14 bowl outs ( probably by phone to stop travelling ) .
As a lover of the game ,as someone who has played for 40 years ( including the last ten as a captain of 2nds and 3rds ) and who wants to play for another 10 ( probably as captain to make sure I get a game on the 3rds and 4ths ) please sort this out for the development of the sport and not by thinking of your club or other outside influences like Cricket Ireland.
While the international team has reached unreal heights and more players can make it to the county circuit I feel our club cricket is in a poor state.
We need leaders at clubs who don't encourage part time players . If they don't want to committ to a team game and teammates give them a voucher for Nevada Bob's and tell them to stop dictating to those that want to play cricket.
Can you imagine Robin Haire at North Down or Roy Harrison or Alan Waite at Waringstown putting up with that type.
I say tweak the cups and rearrangement thing first.I think making the league positions as a qualifying route to the Irish Cup competition is a great idea.At Premier level it gives more teams , more to play for, for longer each season.

Re Fixtures...

My simplistic opinion is that for 3/4 years now we have had one CUP competition too many !
(Especially with our weather)

While I appreciate there canbe no place on the forum or the cricket pitch for that matter, for personnal insults,gratuious remarks and slander etc. I hope the forum does not become a cold house for a bit of 'tongue & cheek' humour and craic !
And how transparent does one have to be?
Whats wrong with using a pseudonym, or having an 'alter-ego' as is the case with ' Old Vic' here.

As I say, its a bit of fun and banter or is that now a taboo in cricket as well.
And for the few that do know me from the lower leagues, I'm sure they'll agree; I take my cricket just as serious as any 'Pro', Premier league player or 'Sugar-daddy' in the country!

And finally, yes well played young Porterfield. Makes it that bit more special when the lads from the home land.

On behalf of everyone associated with the Ulster Cricketer congratulations to William Porterfield on his award of Associate Players of the Year. We have all watched his progress with great interest over the years and in reaching this pinnacle he's done Donemana, Ulster and Irish cricket proud. A genuine son of the soil.
Stand up if you're an Ulster man!

Maybe at Saintfield UTD do they have the waistlines you're describing

Would someone who supports league reduction please explain to me how a reduction of around 20% in the number of games played will help DEVELOP cricket. At a time when incresed active participation in sport is being encouraged by health professionals and certainly required when seeking funding from the funding agencies what sort of a message will we send out in reducing
the number of matches we play. It is very obvious when watching matches that the majority of players don`t play winter sports ..........the evidence is in their waistline measurements and fitness levels.Cricket has a small enough participative level in NI without reducing it further.

For those who only want to play 14 matches and do other things then do that,but don`t force those who want to fully committ to the game to miss out because you want to go around shops/socialize or whatever it is you will do with this "new found" time.

A few observations. If cricket was to run from the last week in April to the second week in September there are about 22 weekend fixtures. Take North Down as an example this year.
18 league games
4 ulster cup
4 Senior cup (plus a couple of gos at the final)
2 Irish senior cup
2 Twenty20

That is potentially 30 days out of 44 weekends. Take out this year probably 9/10 days with rain and what you find is you are playing cricket every single day that is possible at weekends for cricket and that is without progessing in the All Ireland beyond Round 2.

All Ireland should probably be 16-20 team with top 4 from NCU, top 6-8 from Leinster, top 4-6 from NW with previous years winners and winners of cups in each union qualifying.

Ulster Cup - started as top 4 from each union. Go back to that.

T20 - I like Peters concept on this.

League - NCU should follow the lead of NW and get game 2s played in 10 days. No game 3s in first half of season.

If the no of games are reduced, cricketers will start playing golf, water-skiing, shopping, etc on free Saturdays. Fourteen league games is not enough cricket from April - September. Also clubhouses are shut long enough during winter without closing them during summer as well.

Re: P McMorran posting

Unfortunately Peter seems to have overlooked that there is much more to the NCU than just the top tier. The fixture congestion occurs at many levels.

If we focus only on the Premier League then we run the risk of creating the same problem that is blighting local rugby where the number of players and volunteers at lower levels is decreasing because of the time and resources being directed to the elite.

Thanks Peter. We hope it continues to improve!
I've also been reading the emails on the 8-team leagues but I have to say your very detailed points for consideration are the best yet for 'thinking outside the box.' I can see opposition to some of them, but you have provided thought-provoking alternative ideas/suggestions that merit consideration. I agree that we need to rebuild our core league and cup competitions and we need to look down the leagues and make the changes there that are pragmatic and realistic. Their circumstances are very different than the premier league and should reflect this. Unfortunately we have moved into an era where the difference between senior and junior is a club's financial resources and look at football to see how that's destroying the game. In England only 2-3 teams can win the premiership, and in the Champions League probably only two and neither are English! Do we want our cricket to end up like this?

Reducing leagues from 10 to 8 teams.

My understanding is that the thinking behind such a proposal is to try and ensure that better players get to play against each other and to also reduce the fixture congestion.

Before voting on this issue last year our club Committee consulted with our Club Captain, Club Professional, playing members and other senior past playing members. The consensus (if not unanimous) was that reducing the number of teams in the Leagues would not improve the quality of play. No matter how many teams there are in a League there will always be a few teams at the bottom fighting off relegation. What are the consequences? Reduce the League to 6 teams the following year?

The experience of our Club Professional last year, Ewen Thompson , when a similar situation arose in New Zealand, was that a smaller League did not improve the quality of play rather it simply led to a reduction in the number of players playing the game at the top level.

If the objective is to reduce the number of games played whilst improving the quality of matches the solution I would suggest is to retain the strongest of the competitions eg Senior League and Challenge Cup and reduce the number of other Cup matches.

Could the Ulster Cup not become the Twenty/20 Competition. This would not only reduce the number of competitions played from 5 to 4 but also reduce the number of competition sponsors required. Why not even run the competition as a Festival of Cricket (during a closed long weekend or bank holiday weekend) rotating the venue between NW and NCU regions. Sponsors may be very happy to have a focal point for their sponsorship. It might even become a social event supported by wives and families!

Could the Irish Senior Cup not be contested by the top 5 or 6 teams from each region qualifying for entry based on the previous seasons’ league positions. Clubs therefore effectively obtain a seeding based on the previous year’s performance not unlike entry into the Rugby Heineken Cup. This should lead to the better sides and thus players competing against each other for what should be the prestige Cup in Ireland.

I’m not suggesting the above ideas are solutions but they are worthy of further consideration.

A decision not to vote for a reduction of the League to 8 teams should not be seen as support for the current status quo. There is a need to reduce the fixture congestion and improve the general quality of cricket at senior level but the proposal to reduce the number of teams in your strongest competitions is not the solution.

The development of cricketing talent at the highest level is ultimately the responsibility of Cricket Ireland and maybe a reduction in the number of Cup Competitions and thus fixtures could free up a few weekends for the Cricketing Development Authorities to organise Ireland A fixtures or Development Squad Training Sessions.

A few suggestions for consideration.

PS. Clarence your editorial efforts to improve the transparency of comment on the forum are to be applauded.