Forum

Davy McD know one more than me enjoyed the social side of the game . Most Sunday mornings the first question wasn't "did we win?" But "how did I get home?". You looked forward to the trips to Laurelvale, North Down, Holywood in the rugby club, Newforge, Ballymena, Saintfield etc. I can remember many a conversation with the now NCU chairman about "who will stay late but not drink to bring us home? "
However that belonged to another era and social habits have changed , partner expectations have changed and I know from even the last ten years "what time will I be home for? " occupied a lot of people's minds as I captained teams in the Junior Leagues AND not just the young players. People would be available for home games but not away games etc.
So to keep the game alive and I believe we will grow it ( your own club are a shining example of growing ) we have got to " make changes" and I really believe finishing at 6pm with no exceptions is the best way of getting more to play . It can't be allowed to run past because of rain because that's when problems start . With a definite " end time " we can all organise our Saturday evening around that.
School cricket remains important and clubs and the Union should be encouraging more schools to intoduce cricket. Another big change from an earlier era is the number of underage teams and games. When I played you had the Graham Cup and that might have meant one game. Now we have leagues and cups from Under 11's up with some clubs having A and B teams. Maybe we should have an Under 18 league on a Sunday morning as a substitute for Senior School cricket on a Saturday and it could run for May and June only.
I think it's inevitable with more teams we need to play Sunday cricket but if all leagues were 8 teams the need for a lot of double headers disappear.,
I think if the finishing times are sorted the call for less overs will cease. If you are someone who only bowls do you want to bowl less overs ( probably not ) , if you bat in the middle order do you want to get a chance to build an innings (probably). Less overs = less participation = less people wanting to play.
I just think this is staring us all in the face but it needs real leadership to make it happen AND keep the schools on side as they are critical to the continued growth of our sport.
Clubs need to work closer with schools and not just establihed schools.
It's changing times but personally I wouldn't change that "how did I get home?" era for anything .

the secret to chasing down waringstown seconds fine total of 295 hot chicken fillet burgers freshly baked sausage rolls savoury pasta ham and tomato sandwiches chicken coleslaw sandwiches chicken tikka sandwiches a selection of fresh fruit bananas grapes chocolate covered doughnuts a selection of yoghurts biscuits of various choice freshly brewed coffee and tea all well presented by the captains wife now i seen at least 3 players going up 3 times to refill their plates they started off bowling and fielding well but at the end of the 50 overs they knew they had overindulged for their surely was a feast of runs absolutely nothing to do with mr baguleys sublime 107 not out connor breets smashing 85 david raineys quickfire 39 and les allens cameo 25 it was masterminded in the kitchen by the tea lady lol

As regards to all these fine proposals and innovative ideas in order to check this much talked about'malaise' in local cricket, I sincerely hope no 'bright spark' once again suggests omitting the customary tea interval and the much looked forward to food and refrestments that go along with the interval.

Setting aside all the camaraderie, loving-up and team bonding, I for one after being out in the field for whatever number of overs, am absolutely ravenous and ready for a feed!

I recollect a couple of seasons ago that said 'bright spark' got their way and a notion was passed to waive the manditory teas and though mercifully most clubs ignored this obscure ruling and allowed common sense and hospitaly to prevail, some followed the letter of the law and provided naff all for their travelling opponents, a course of action that caused much outcry if memory serves me right!

Come to think of it, it was the lower teams of a certain few 'big' premier clubs which chose not to provide any grub for their guests, I wonder why ?

Perhaps they needed to save their money for other things ??

Early starts

Having now played nearly my first full season in about a decade and umpired one match, I can honestly say I have not heard a single complaint about early starts.

How it is achieved for a full season with the schools agreeing a format I do not know, but if you want players back playing it is the way forward.

another contributing factor to late finishes is slow over rates. At least when official umpires are present they can impose sanctions.

11am starts, finished for 6pm, no teas etc. Time for me to hang up the spikes I think.
after working all week I enjoy relaxing or getting a couple of chores done on a Saturday morning before having to leave for the game, then having a yarn over a brew and a couple of sarnies (or chicken and chips when lucky enough to be at middle road), then after the game a shower and pint are in order and renew aquaintances with players I have played against in the past and chat cricket with those I have just played against.
If the only way you communicate with opposing players is on the field, how are you ever going to get to know them? And if you know an opponent socially then I feel the "banter" on the field is better meaning more enjoyment, more enjoyment will mean more players.
The problem currently I feel is too much Sunday cricket, if you are leaving the WAG on a Saturday morning with the promise of a day together on the Sunday she is likely to be more forgiving than if you try and tell her that you are leaving at 8:30 or 9am both days even if you can be home at 7pm

Ivan - I think we are in agreement on the Schools thing. There are a lot of good people in the schools doing a lot of good work. But there needs to be a coming together and willing to compromise for the "greater good".

I also think that if club cricket took precedence on a Saturday with 11am starts for J1 I would be much less inclined to think a reduction in overs is necessary. The number of people within the league who have commented on how great the 11am starts are the last few weeks is very high.

With regards to a later start in the season for J4 down, that was in relation to schools continuing Saturday cricket for forms 1-4. Of course I forgot to take into account the shorter duration of those games meaning they could still start later and allow for earlier finishes in that scenario.

Neale
Still believe you and MT in a UFC showdown would be good viewing but glad to see you've kissed and made up. I'm sure, like this post, you've seen through the facetious of this message (incidentally, and MT might appreciate this, one of only 2 words in our language with all 5 vowels in order - prize for the other, clue being I'm not being it in Spain!)
There are more feckin roundabouts here than in craigavon. Where is Webster when you need him. Enjoy the states, see you anon

Fossie.

Glad you made it to Costa Blanca - obviously no new roundabouts in Spain to confuse you.
See Michael and I have sorted this matter out cordially without resorting to pugilism. Anyway you know he'd kick my ass in 20 secs - I suspect that's the basis of your encouragement.
Suppose you,lol be trying to get a bit of umpiring in when away?

Catch up when you get back.

Neale

Michael.

Appreciate your response.

Neale

Neale,

If the NCU plays no part in propagating the arguments that I have described as "bullshit", then I apologise sincerely and I will do so again in my next column,

Michael

Reports of the death of NCU cricket are premature and there were cries for the cricket pathologist to be sacked from those of us who were at Carrick for the Lagan Valley Steels T20 trophy last night. When you witness an event as entertaining and as well organised as this one there are only blue skies on the horizon.

Firstly the Carrick club. Twenty years ago I played for NCU presidents XI here when they invited Sir Garry Sobers to open their new club house. Prior to that they operated from a green painted tin shed. Now look at the place and people running it! That's not death that's healthy progress.

Then Cliftonville and marvellous to see so many players from their golden era still playing the game they love alongside some promising youngsters. Age shall not weary them etc..and the sun is not going down just yet!

And lastly muckamore both loved by some and maligned by others the likes of "billy" and "Peter" on here. But tonight a young side mostly teenagers and early twenties supplemented by good coaching and a great innings from a guy who looks like he should have had a lot more Ireland caps than he got.

A most enjoyable evening for a crowd of several hundred and a match played in the true spirit of cricket. Cricket is alive and well on this evidence!

Michael and Neale

A la Harry Hill. Only one way to settle this.....FIGHT!

Great stuff - who needs a kindle for holiday reading. This debate tops anything Irvine Welsh has to offer! Keep it coming

Michael.

I agree with what you say about statistics - in fact I made that very point when mentioning the growth in league teams in the last 2 years.

My point was you left out ALL the positives and growth areas therefore your conclusions are imbalanced.

Your research has uncovered 4 Cricket Ureland articles. I did not defend cricket Ireland. My challenge was to ask you to justify the accusation of Bullsh*t peddling against local officials - ie the NCU. Your response fails to address that. Put up your evidence against me and my colleagues or withdraw that unpleasant accusation.

One of the few common themes running through the posts on the state of cricket seems to be "finished by 6pm". I think if that was addressed the number of overs etc would become less significant.
If you allow four minutes per over and half an hour for tea then simply work back the start times depending on the number of overs deemed for that league.
I personally think the overs are about right at each level. I think teas are important in that it's a chance to catch up with teammates what they have been up to during the week or a chance to think how you are going to approach the second half of the game.
So 50 over game would start at 10.50am , 40 over game at 12.10pm , a 35 over game at 12.50pm and a 30 over game at 1.30pm.
Overs reduced immediately and subsequently for every 8 minutes lost down to a minimum of 20 overs.
Or alternatively if all cricket started at say 10.45am then the 50 over game would end at 5.55pm , the 40 over game at 4.35pm , the 35 over game at 3.55pm and the 30 over game at 3.15pm.
If cricket was played within those hours I think there would be less clamour for shorter games etc. I know one of the most frequent questions asked of me was " what time will I be home at?" Even the biggest travel distances in the NCU a player or spectator in a senior team could be home by 7.30pm
Another advantage of having a uniform start time is if they wish the junior teams can get back and see the last hour or so of a senior game helping with the atmosphere but also learn by watching .
I think the early start times ( guaranteed with no hanging around because of rain ) you would get a greater participation of both youth and adults and quickly see more teams emerge and an end to "walkovers".
I speak as someone who played at senior level for twenty years and then captained in the Junior Leagues at 2nds, 3rds and 4ths for another 20 years so I have heard all the reasons from my own experiences and those of opposition captains.
The " elephant in the room" is schools cricket on a Saturday. This is driven by a team of well respected , well meaning cricket lovers but surely it's time to sit down with them and explain " you are killing the game you claim to love".
You can introduce children to cricket at school , coach them and provide them with games WITHOUT playing on a Saturday morning. There are many fine cricketers playing senior cricket today ( 25th July) who never played Saturday cricket at school. Of the 350 people playing 1sts cricket in the NCU today how many played cricket at school on a Saturday morning ? There's a stat for Michael and Neale to get a grip on . I'm sure most of the captains could quickly go down their scorecard and give you that answer.
Antrim Grammar introduced Saturday cricket in 2014 and because of shortage of teachers a few of us at Muckamore agreed to umpire. I umpired two under 13 games and just know that none of the 22 players could say they got a lot of fun from that 2 hours. In one game the second innings chasing 18 lasted 7 balls. In the one game I umpired this season there were 57 wides ( and those were only the ones that didn't bounce on the mat ) . Now if I had been doing what I needed to do ( stop, point out little things etc ) those games would have lasted for a good three hours and that would still only been papering over the cracks.
Schools are important in the development of any sport and with more cooperation between club and school I think we will produce more quality players. This cooperation could start with the dropping of Saturday school cricket and an agreed commitment from each club to reach out in terms of coaches going in to local,schools.
There's enough money paid to overseas players it should be a pre requisite that they do 3 hours a day five days a week in local schools for 8 weeks . Clubs have students or retired people or people who are self employed or on flexitime who could give up,a few hours to help,coach in schools.
Michael's stats paint a bleak picture and I'll accept that stats can be manipulated to suit the story but those of us who have been closely involved know that Michael's picture is a pretty accurate one in relation to what's happening on the ground .
It needs fixed and I for one can't see how playing shorter games or regionalising the game helps except to delay "grasping the nettle " about Saturday schools cricket. I know there will be passionate pleas about the role it had played in the past etc etc but the evidence isn't there to say it has a role to play in today's society .NCU numbers are in decline in male adult cricket. We are seeing more end more withdrawals and walkovers. We aren't producing internationals in the region. The last Ulster players to be capped McBrine, Thompson, Young - how much Saturday school cricket did they play ? The Ulster representatives in the latest under 19 World Cup qualifiers - Dennison, Mitchell, Gillespie and the two McClintocks - how much Saturday school cricket did they play ?
If the answer is what I think it is then it proves the clubs and the Unions can produce players .
If at the AGM this October it was announced that all cricket would start at 10.45am and the cut off even in 50 over games was 6pm I think by the times teams are registered by the end of November that we would see an increase in the teams playing.
We have tinkered with everything else but we haven't "grasped the nettle " on starting and finishing times. Why NOT AT LEAST TRY. and I know there are "optional by agreement " flexibility built in at present. That doesn't work all the time so set the starting times in stone, reduce the overs from 10.45am onwards and have a definitive finishing time based on 4 minutes for an over . Then players , partners, fans, umpires, scorers, media people can plan their social and family time without cricket interrupting those plans. I speak as someone who played schools cricket on a Saturday for five years and looked forward to getting picked up at the school gates to go and play another game but today's adults don't want to be getting home at 8.30pm or later so they stop playing and school kids suffer with no club cricket.